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lightdancer |
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Yeah, well, we'll see what comes through....hahahaha...you never know.
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omcasey |
Merging and Emerging | ||
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What if we came at this from the idea, of man experiencing through contrast the love that God is - being God inspired? What would happen if we said God (not ego) inspired contrast? Inspired His Angel Lucifer to hold the frequency opposite Himself, so that on a place called Earth, THROUGH contrast man could experience the love that God is?.. What if we said it was and is a JOY for His Angel to receive this inspiration, that this inspiration is what makes him strong, and that through him, God's blessing is endlessly flowing?.. There is a very clear contrast in this statement-- "There must be some reconciliation point between realizing that actions from an unclear mind do have hurtful, detrimental effects and realizing that those actions didn't really mess up anything afterall. ?" With contrast there must always be a merging and emerging, otherwise, in our experience, contrast sits stagnant in perpetual irreconciliation (-the way those on two sides who refuse to meet remain irreconciled). Is it true? Isn't this merging and e-merging the action that reconciles and brings new experience - through us - into being? Isn't it just this that broadens us? What if God broadened, .e x t e n d e d .the experience of Himself as He merged with the Angel Lucifer -who so filled with God's inspiration, held the (fear) frequency opposite Him. As this happened, did a whole new world of experience not emerge? And did all who are here, so filled with this same inspiration not step into it? I would offer wholeheartedly that we did, and that we are.. and that this is why we cannot get it wrong -no matter what it may look like to ourself or to anyone else, in every moment ALL are being inspired and moved by the love of God; even those who are currently or sporadically holding the frequency of an unclear mind. Through the evolution of this experience, through you, and me, and all others who so inspired, step forward into it - God Himself (Love) is expanding. It is the one true Wonder of our world.. what do you think? is it a good beginning? . |
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omcasey |
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Is it coming through that a part of the reconciliation for me is that we are in every moment God/Love inspired and moved, that God/Love is the essence of every
action - and that from any point, even that of fear or confusion there is an evolution of experience that not only catches us up to this Fact, but also spreads
It as we go..
is there more? there may be more . . .
Last Edited By: omcasey
12/27/08 21:59:27.
Edited 1 times.
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Dancing Lotus |
An Aside to Chaya | ||
Chaya: I'm right there with you on the need to recognize the feminine aspects of the Divine, D-Lo. After reading some more of raj's words, I see he does sometimes use the term Mother/father God, but not consistently. I can see that usage is a bit clumsy. Funny how concepts become embedded/bound linguistically. I will share something I received recently from a Native Elder. (my paraphrase) What we have is a bird with two wings. The bird has intention of flying with integrity, but it just keeps making circles in the sand.
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Namaste
We Radiate
rainbows for
the benefit of
all humanity.
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omcasey |
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Kathleen
This imagery is beautiful, thank you! What you're offering is not so much an aside for me, the parallel seems identical with what has me talking of contrast and merging/emerging. The contrast can be of love and fear - or of the divine masculine and divine feminine - or of any number of things. When fear is freed and drawn toward merging with love, or when the divine feminine is freed and drawn toward merging with the divine masculine, what E-merges? - an energy (bird) that can take flight, yes! surely.. And, perhaps even more intimately, with this energy, or thrust of energy moving through YOU, and me, and all, what new worlds of experience are brought into being.. for all who are so inspired to step forward into.. is the connection coming through? . |
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Dancing Lotus |
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Oh Yeah, Big Time and with much JOY. I am in the middle of a few things, but I think I might come back later and reply more thoroughly to your
poetic post! ~ ~
We Radiate
rainbows for
the benefit of
all humanity.
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Dancing Lotus |
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Casey,
You know when I posted to Chaya, I had not yet seen your Merging and emerging post and the one that followed it. I just read it now after my reply to you. What you and Carie are grappling with is something that I keep coming back to. Lots coming to me from all over the place about this reconciliation. Nothing articulate as this time, except if there is more bring it through. ~ ~
We Radiate
rainbows for
the benefit of
all humanity.
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lightdancer |
reconciliation | ||
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"If it's all perfect, that is, if it's the best it can be and there's no room for improvement, why is there
this possibility for me to actually operate from such a huge chasm of misperception? It's obviously not the perfect way to operate. -- There must be some
reconciliation point between realizing that actions from an unclear mind do have hurtful, detrimental effects and
realizing that those actions didn't really mess up anything afterall. ?"
Well, after weeks of contemplating this, I think I'm finding what feels like some clarity. Much of my confusion had to do with the idea of the ego. I apologize in advance if this sounds like a ramble. For example, much of what I read and study says that the ego (thinking I'm separate from God) is nothing but a misperception, an illusion, that it isn't real and that, basically, whatever actions arise from that misperception, which result in suffering for ourselves or others, aren't real either. At least, that's my understanding that's accrued over the years. And yet, there's a lot of talk in the yoga world about a very real thing called the ego, about overcoming it, denying it, getting out of it, being released from it, etc. I understand that I can't actually be separate from God, yet, I have had very real experiences of actually thinking that I am and actually operating from that mindset, inflicting suffering on myself and others as a result. So, on the one hand, there's no such actual thing as the ego and, on the other hand, there's this thing called the ego. This is highly confusing to me. How can there be both? How can there be what looks like suffering (effects of ego mentality) going on and, yet, how can it also be said that there's not any suffering really happening? To say that suffering does not exist, (and I did this for a long time, thinking I was understanding what I was saying) yet experience it myself and witness it in others on a daily basis is total denial. I'm finally understanding Donny's point of argument with me over all these years. The two just don't add up. They're incongruent and are polar opposites. To say the ego is an illusion, or to say it doesn't exist, yet operate from it myself and watch others do the same just doesn't gel. I mean, I CAN operate from a misperception, indeed. It's a very real experience for me; it's not a non-experience. In fact, it's my experience and my reality a lot of the time. Has been for lifetimes, probably. And to say it's not real, to expect that to change things, while still operating from it is insane. It'll never be congruent and will never be harmonious. This is/was the crux of my problem with all this perfection stuff. And trying to come to an understanding of all this can be very heady...even for me, who likes heady stuff. I did a lot of researching through Raj transcripts and found something that really opened the door for me on all this. He uses a microscope analogy to talk about the ego. He says something like you're in your house, things are going along normally, someone's in the kitchen cooking dinner. You've decided to go into your room and get out your microscope. You decide to put a tiny little piece of tissue or something under the microscope and look through to see what you can see. You become fascinated with what's going on in there and you stay and stay and stay and become further and further engrossed in it. You're not somewhere else. You're not actually in another place. You're still in your house, you're still looking at what's in your house, but you've just narrowed down your view of the whole to a teeny, microscopic part. Someone calls from the other room to tell you dinner's ready, but you can't hear them because you're so immersed in your narrowly focused view. Pretty soon, the microscopic view becomes your world. It's all you can see. And your head starts to hurt because you've been squinching your eyes for so long, you get grumpy because you haven't eaten. And this becomes the norm of how it is to live in your world. Headaches and grumpiness and dizzyness is part of life, it's just the way it is. And someone comes along and tells you the headache is all an illusion. They say what you're seeing is an illusion, that it's not really what's going on. "Oh, okay," you say. "It's all an illusion, this isn't real," while continuing to stare through the microscope, without stepping back, without doing anything differently. So, going back to that quote up there that we've been discussing, is it imperfect that I should decide to stare at the tissue through the microscope? No. I could do it because it's there to do. But I'm still in the house. Dinner is still cooking. I haven't really gone anywhere else. I only thought I did. I can experience what feels like a separation, a removal from the house and the dinner cooking and my family in the other room. I can experience actual effects of being off somewhere else in my mind, immersed in what feels like something else; something interesting at first, that soon became an obsession. So, for me, the ego is just being immersed in the microscopic view. The microscopic view isn't something different; it's still the house. The microscopic view just isn't the big picture; it's an extremely narrow focus. And a narrow focus will hurt after a while. As it should. So, my reconciliation point with all this has to do with that microscope analogy. The effects from being hunched over the microscope for years and lifetimes are real and experiencable - my headache is real, my dizzyness from squinching my eyes is real...it's definitely experiencable...BUT it's totally unnecessary. The headache comes to remind me to change something - to sit back and widen my view. Once I finally sit back, the suffering doesn't last, it goes away...it doesn't endure. That's the big revelation for me. It doesn't endure. What endures is grace. No matter how bad my head hurts, no matter how bad things get, it's never permanent. There's always a glimmer of light that penetrates. There's always the little plant that makes its way up through the massive concrete street, somewhere, somehow. I took the quote from Raj that Erich started the thread with and plugged in "ego." I don't know if Erich or Raj would agree with this, but it helped me. So it read like this: It is really very dangerous to your Sanity to believe that the ego is an illusion. It is also dangerous to your Sanity to believe that the ego is real, but it has nothing to do with God. In other words, my words, it's insane to believe that the microscopic view is an illusion, while continuing to sit there and stay immersed in it. It's insane to keep taking aspirin for the headache while continuing to look through the microscope. And it's insane to believe that the microscopic view is real, while totally denying that it's the microscopic view of something larger and omnipresent. Anyway, that's where I am now with all this. Don't know if it's right or wrong or what, but it definitely feels like it reconciles things for me...at least, for now. There's a lot more, but I'll stop here. with love, Carie
Last Edited By: lightdancer
01/07/09 09:23:42.
Edited 1 times.
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omcasey |
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I enjoyed reading this, Carie. Thank you for elaborating your point in such a clear easy to follow way -I rest with you 100 % on this ~
"In other words, my words, it's insane to believe that the microscopic view is an illusion, while continuing to sit there and stay immersed in it. It's insane to keep taking aspirin for the headache while continuing to look through the microscope. And it's insane to believe that the microscopic view is real, while totally denying that it's the microscopic view of something larger and omnipresent." Yes, surely! it is insane to remain indefinitely at odds with yourself . . Am I getting you? Something that arises for me when I take in your initial query ~ "If it's all perfect, that is, if it's the best it can be and there's no room for improvement, why is there this possibility for me to actually operate from such a huge chasm of misperception? It's obviously not the perfect way to operate. -- There must be some reconciliation point between realizing that actions from an unclear mind do have hurtful, detrimental effects and realizing that those actions didn't really mess up anything afterall. ?" . . is the perfection of choice -the perfection of the essential Fact that we are in every moment mastering the very next step we take -our very next breath.. Not just individually, but collectively. Mastering the ability to not only (consciously) choose for ourself, but to, without any judgment, allow all others to choose for themself as well. It is a mastering of the ability to extend our birthright beyond ourself, to all.. A mastering of the ability to Give (as God Gives).. It truly is a JOY to be here experiencing this happen -just inside what all of it looks like.. there IS an awakening occurring amongst us and the truth, as I am seeing it, is there will always be a choice through every moment of the awakening to experience it through pain and suffering (ego) - or to experience it through JOY there is a deep, and profound beauty in this I am only beginning to see . . with love . |
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lightdancer |
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KFN |
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Carie, that was very clear and well said. The microscope analogy
reminded me of something a visiting dharma teacher spoke about with our Vipassana group. I wish I could remember her exact words, but I'm going to have
to wing it, so if it's muddy, that's my fault. She said that the ego is not unreal or unnecessary, it's just prone to getting an inflated opinion
of itself based on its myopic point of view -- if the ego was represented by your thumb and you held it an inch in front of your eyeball, it takes up your
whole field of vision, but if you extend your arm out away from you, and take the long view, you see that the ego is just a small functionary in the vastness
of it all. She pointed out that there is no need to 'kill' or deny the ego... and when you try to use your practice for that purpose, of course it
feels threatened, so it puffs up and fights back... instead, if you can gently show it the bigger picture, eventually it can heave a big sigh of relief, stop
trying to run the whole show, and just handle it's own little jobs.
Casey
and the truth, as I am seeing it, is there will always be a choiceYes, "profound beauty in this" and in you!
karen |
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Erich Schiffmann |
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you guys are damn good
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lightdancer |
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Erich:
Karen, yes, I love that. It reminds me of something else I discovered through all this. I'll try to post in the morning. I love you guys. Thanks for being here. |
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LauraCarpini |
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Hey Carie...
That was such a cool explanation about the microscope and all... thanks. So, I'm wondering, or I'm still wondering about stuff like cancer cells... I mean they function perfectly as cancer in and of themselves - they themselves are a part of being. Is it then our fear or resistance against the cancer cells that make them harmful to us, or since nothing can really harm the eternal, being nature that we are... just our inability to see the bigger landscape of what's going on - then the cancer cells don't really matter? But then they are matter in and of themselves...like a wall... or a desk... would these objects just become completely amorphous so we could go through them at will...and maybe through cancer too if we understood what was going on from the larger, more accurate view? I mean like a grizzly will rip a human apart... but it is still perfect in it's being as a grizzly. If we let go of the fear of the grizzly will it then become benign to us? Oh - good night for now. L |
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omcasey |
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Laura,
When we let go of fear, WE become benign. This is what elevates us into being impervious to attack/injury . . is it true? Everything is a choice -all experience is a choice.. Cancer is a choice, encountering a grizzly is a choice, letting go of fear is a choice. If we are experiencing these things it is because we are choosing to experience them, we are in some way saying yes to them. The sooner we see this the sooner we will find ourself opening out into the big picture, the macrocosmic view -surrendering the one color (the one choice) to the kaleidoscope!.. It is wondrous, when I am seeing a choice I am making -as one in an OCEAN of possible choices.. As easily as I can step into one, I can step into another. I can step into experiencing cancer and cancer cells, and no matter how fully I choose to do this, no matter how far into the experience I choose to go, at any moment it is true that just as easily I can choose again, and this time step into wellness and healthy cells. The specific choices I make have no power, or authority over me ever. No ability to hold me in any way. I am the energy of myself, always, moving through one creation/creative experience to another - every moment of my inexhaustible life . . it is truuuee .
Last Edited By: omcasey
01/07/09 23:10:30.
Edited 2 times.
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LauraCarpini |
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Hi Casey...
Coool. L |
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lightdancer |
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I had no idea that when Erich started this thread that I'd be having such huge epiphanies about things I already thought I understood.
I am realizing that part of my problems with all this perfection stuff has been that I thought, on a subconscious level, that saying "yes" to waking up, saying "yes" to these truths that I've read about and have studied ("it's all perfect," for example), meant saying "no" to everything, as I know it. I realized that I don't want to let go of everything I think I know...because, basically, that would require denying what I do know - my world, my reality and everything in it - in favor of what I don't know - some other world, some other reality that I don't yet know. I don't want to say "no" to my reality and "no" to my world as I see it and experience it. No wonder I have so much fear. And no wonder I've been having such inner conflict and confusion. I love my world. I love so much and feel so much. There's such incredible wonder and indescribable beauty. I don't want to wake up and find out that that view of the pacific ocean that always takes my breath away, every single awesome, beautiful time, is an illusion or that it's non-existent. I don't want to find out that my favorite tree down in the park isn't really there. I don't want to discover that these things, and more, are just figments of my ego imagination and that if I were really evolved, spiritually, and if I were a real yogi or on some higher dimensional plane than the hopeless, common man, that these silly earthly images would vanish and I'd finally see only beautiful golden energetic grid lines or something. Or, if I were awake enough, everything that once seemed to be beautifully colored and textured would suddenly be formless white energy gel. Or worse, we'd all find ourselves named Neo or Trinity and be dressed in shades of gray. Since I had such confusion with the ego being something else, a different mindset rather than just a microscopic mindset, I thought that by saying "yes" to enlightenment or "yes" to waking up, that I would then begin to experience an entirely different reality, an entirely different world. Either what I'm seeing an experiencing is real, or it's not real. One or the other. Ego or Truth. Nothingness or Reality. It's so amazing to me how even spirituality, in the name of Singular Oneness, can show a path of two-ness. It's mind boggling. I didn't realize this until just now, but saying "no" to my world and my reality would also mean that I was an utter failure. In other words, if this - everything I know, everyone I have met, everything I love - is "all an illusion" or simply nothing that came from a nothing, non-existent mindset, then everything I have done is all in vain. It would mean that all these lifetimes I have done and experienced nothing but nothingness. In my view, saying "yes" to waking up would mean admitting that I have been so far gone, so out of touch, so stupid, such a hopeless, original-sin case, that I've been living in a total dreamland in which nothing means anything. I have heard someone say that if you were to suddenly wake up right now, fully, totally, in one snap - that it would be too much to take. That you'd freak. I, like all of us, have an innate wisdom, an innate intelligence. I, like all of us, do have moments of clarity. I think that's undeniable, even in light of our confusion most of the time. I don't like thinking that I'm just a hopeless case or a total failure. Not because I have an inflated opinion of myself, but because in grounded calmness...I know it's not true. I don't like thinking I have been so foolish for all these years and lifetimes that I've just been living in fantasyland the whole time. I've had too many meaningful experiences to also know this just isn't true. This is why, I think, the microscope analogy and now the thumb analogy that Karen offered is so helpful. It meets me where I am. I find huge peace in that. It doesn't deny my reality or say it's non-existent or that everything I've been doing is in vain. It doesn't say I'm a stupid human, born of original sin, doomed to fail. It says, "Hey, just realize you're having a tiny perspective, that's all." What I get from it is that when I have moments of clarity and even when I wake up totally, I'm still going to be seeing the very same things I've always been seeing. This IS reality, it's not nothing, it's not an illusion, and it's definitely not non-existent. Colors are real, textures are real, the beautiful Pacific view is very real. The only illusory thing there is, I'm thinking, is perspective. I've understood this for a long time, and I'm not saying anything new, but now it feels like I'm really knowing it. A brilliant man once said - well, actually, he has said it many times - "It's important to keep the big picture in mind, always." He also said - and has said many times - "This is the local view of Infinity." I think, after all these years, I'm finally beginning to get a glimmer of what he means.
Last Edited By: lightdancer
01/09/09 09:20:44.
Edited 1 times.
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noswrite |
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Isn't the helicopter analogy brilliant?
Equanimity born of non-attachment to desire increases the altitude high enough to afford a wide, encompassing perspective, while simultaneously retaining the perspectives of other levels, from rooftops, to crowded streets, interpersonal relationships, thoughts, to the knee-high perspective of animals, to the microscopic level, etc. ... which is also analogous to the fourth dimension encompassing dimensions 1,2, & 3.
"I made this letter longer than usual because I lack the time to make it short."
- Blaise Pascal |
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Frangipani |
Don't put your hand in the flame yet.. | ||
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Erich,
Reading the above makes my eyes water and when my eyes water, I sense/know/connect with the Big Mind very easily, ahh. It is a real moment of truth. I am grateful for this and the whole process is more curious to me than 'making the attainment my goal of being the perfect, unblemished me.' There is a thin line here about seeing the Oneness and being the Oneness, continually, on-going-ly in each fresh new now moment. This is a BIg teaching and heals me. I settle into a lovely spacious place....
Then a thought comes, like..' yeah! I've been a good practitioner let's tell everyone how good I am.'...then I get myself into trouble. It is kinda funny the way you put it - about being ready to put your hand in the flame without getting unkind consequences. This idea is a big lift in my bootstraps. Here's lifting up my heart to you The weather right now is extreme wind and it reminds me of my thoughts, how they can go every where and no where all at the same time. And there is still a still place where all is centered, at ease, still. I am grateful for this moment of reflection. Thanks to MIS community for being a light on my path,
Frangipani |
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jeannettel |
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Casey said
<When we let go of fear, WE become benign. This is what elevates us into being impervious to attack/injury .> Would the letting go of fear be possible only when you have stepped back from the microscope so to speak? My microscopic view is so filled with fear that in that state of viewing , the choice not to have it does not seem like an option . A decision to let go of fear here has no staying power, or so it feels. So what I am wondering really is , how to be in the place where it is possible to make choices of what to experience ? How to incorporate it into the daily living of ones life? To take it from a concept which I think about to one which I live? Jeannette |
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